Vote vote vote--and rec rec rec rec

[ellen_datlow]

Ok. Here's my impassioned plea/push/nag for anyone who reads this blog and is eligible to recommend stories and or novels for the various peer group science fiction, fantasy, and horror awards.
I know that some people feel that awards themselves are a bad thing and that they should all be abolished. I'm not talking to you. I don't believe that and I know I'm not going to change your minds.

Awards are NOT going to go away but they could become less visible (which I think is a bad thing). As an editor I really appreciate it when the stories/books I edit make final award ballots and win awards. And I think most writers are even more appreciative of this. It gives a sense of validation for what you're doing by your peers (for the Nebula and Stoker).

Right now is "award rec season" and there are discussions on both the SFWA Bulletin Board and the HWA Bulletin Board about how their respective awards are dying --not enough members are recommending works to even make a preliminary ballot.

Now some people think that this might be because no one likes the work being published.
Others that no one is reading enough short fiction to be interested in recommending works in those categories.
I have a really difficult time believing the first reason. I've been reading sf/f/h short fiction for twenty five years and have found no drop off in quality in any of those fields.

I can't answer for the second but I hope it's not true because if so my profession will die and I love editing short fiction.

If you care at ALL for the genre short story then I urge you to recommend the stories that you think are worth bringing to the attention of your peers.

This is totally off the cuff and I know if I thought about it more I'd have more to write--but I'd also probably just delete the whole post...

Comments welcome!

Comments

[nihilistic-kid.livejournal.com]

Now some people think that this might be because no one likes the work being published.

Ding ding ding!

[ellen-datlow.livejournal.com]

You're welcome to speak for yourself, but overall that's just bullshit. There's plenty of great short sf/f/h fiction out there--I read it all the time and have been reading it for over 25 years. As an active member of HWA I've recommended tons of good stories--unfortunately, it doesn't seem that more than one or two other members have read those stories, which is a shame.

[bluetyson.livejournal.com]

Yeah, all the writer types should just give up because they all suck. Novels, stories, whatever, people prefer tv and movies and video games anyway, don't they?

[(Anonymous)]

Ellen,

I think there may be fewer people who are reading and writing short fiction that are part of the professional organizations and therefore not eligible to nominate or vote.

John Klima

[david-de-beer.livejournal.com]

I'm going to second this comment.

I'd love to have the hard data, but since I don't I can only toss some speculations in the ring which comes down to less and less people are HWA and especially SFWA members, or interested.
Again, I don't know the hard facts, but somebody a while back mentioned that it looked to her that increasingly younger writers were simply not interested in the SFWA; this sentiment seemed mostly to be confirmed on a poll Mary Robinette Kowal had on her blog.
A lot of people who did qualify for at least associate (or haven't yet) were either not interested at all, or ex-members with no intention of renewing membership.

There, most probably, is your problem. I think people would vote, but they're not allowed. The problem may have nothing to do with short fiction itself and everything with the organizations themselves losing ground with people.
(sorry, John, just wanted to second your comment, and it turned a bit ramblish)

[ineti.livejournal.com]

Ellen, thanks for the post. I'm going to post something similar to my own blog and get the word out. And of course, read more and nominate more!

[ellen-datlow.livejournal.com]

Great. If those who CARE about the awards (and short fiction for that matter) don't do something we can't expect anything to change.

[orrin.livejournal.com]

I would be happy to nominate some stuff, but unfortunately I'm not presently a member of any of the relevant professional organizations, so that's out.

[ellen-datlow.livejournal.com]

Well, keep reading anyway and if you like some blog about it... I'm not a voting member of SFWA so all I can do is whine :-)

I care...

[themadblonde]

but I'm not eligible, sorry. 8-(

Re: I care...

[ellen-datlow.livejournal.com]

As I said to someone else--you can still read and talk about the stories/novels you like--just to get other readers interested. It's not ONLY about awards (as far as I'm concerned) it's about the life of the sf/f/h short story. That's what awards are good for--bringing attention to the forms that are given awards. But reading is the most important thing.

[unrealfred.livejournal.com]

Me neither, unfortunately.

Vote

[alaneer.livejournal.com]

I would if I could. I read short fiction and novels all the time and have several favorites.

Perhaps next year I will be eligible to nominate some.

Re: Vote

[ellen-datlow.livejournal.com]

That's as much as you can do --as long as you recommend your favorites to other readers. Part of what I enjoy about reading for and editing the YBFH over all these years is that my job is to tell readers what I've loved reading during the year. I'm a pusher ;-)

[cherylmmorgan.livejournal.com]

Fan-voted awards need recommendations too, and they also tend to be light on short fiction. At Science Fiction Awards Watch we'll be starting our major push for recommendations in December, but the lists are open now. If anyone here would like to make recommendations we'd love to hear from you. Hopefully our lists will also help jog the memories of people who can vote in the awards Ellen is talking about.

[jenwrites.livejournal.com]

Is it kosher to put your own stuff on those pages, or would that be tacky?

[jasminehammer.livejournal.com]

I don't think it's a quality issue or even having less readers. I love reading short fiction and come across stuff I love all the time. I wish there were an award I could recommend these stories for, but I'm not a member of the organizations you mentioned. I'd join SFWA if I was eligible just for voting priviledges!
Are there fan-based awards that we should all be recommending for?

[david-de-beer.livejournal.com]

>I'd join SFWA if I was eligible just for voting priviledges!


really? hmm, I don't know, that seems wrong to me, like it should be a (small) side-aspect of the SFWA, and yet...this is the only genuine reason people appear to want to join.

[jimvanpelt.livejournal.com]

I don't know about the Stoker, but nominating for the Nebula is so easy that there shouldn't be any excuse at all for an interested member not getting in his/her nominations. The list of currently nominated works is available in the private area of the SFWA website, and all nominators need to do is click on an already listed story and type in their name and e-mail address. To nominate a work that isn't on the list already is also easy and can be done on line.

[ellen-datlow.livejournal.com]

The Stoker is easy too--it's online and you fill in the blanks of the form.

[charlesatan.livejournal.com]

Don't have the power to vote or recommend either but maybe we can be infectious about it. Started a meme:
Vote and Recommend New Short Stories Meme

[ellen-datlow.livejournal.com]

Yayyy! That's the ticket. Very cool. It's certainly a start.

[cinriter.livejournal.com]

Thanks, Ellen! Yep, we need to get more people rec'cing.

I will say I truthfully haven't read as much stuff I've loved this year...but I'm about to jump into three different anthologies, so I expect to start rec'cing my little heart out soon.

And here's a confession: One reason I'm against the idea of making the Stoker recs anonymous is that I often use your recs as a reading guide. I just ordered GENERATION LOSS because I saw that you (and Nick) had recommended it. At this point I think vote-trading is less of a problem than any voting at all...

[ellen-datlow.livejournal.com]

Hey Lisa! (Lisa's a fellow HWA member). Did you get the email I just sent you as to when the Stoker deadline is this year (for recs)?

I do think I'm going to occasionally cut and paste my ongoing mini-reviews of books from whatever YBFH I'm working on. I wonder if I should post my Stoker recs for short and long stories, too. What do you think about that?

GENERATION LOST is excellent! I could go either way with the anonymous rec issue but you make a good point. I too, sometimes use the recs to check out something I might not ordinarily and who recs it does make a difference.

[dbraum.livejournal.com]

I try to spread the word to my non-writer ( and writer )friends as relatives as best I can. Usually this means buying them copies of my favorite reads as gifts, holiday and otherwise. Kind of like voting with your dollars a bit.

a recommendation

[dbraum.livejournal.com]

General Slocum's Gold, a novella by Nick Kaufmann, is high a top my recommended reading for this year.

[golaski.livejournal.com]

This is related to your lament re. King's essay. As members of literary communities that are often marginalized, it's very important that we promote our best. Whether the awards are meaningful or not entirely depends on the quality of the work they reward, and so nominations are extremely important. As a non-member, I can only recommend by publishing excellent fiction, and by word of mouth. Jaime Corbacho's "Honeymoon" is the best horror story I've read in some time. Paul Walther's "Splitfoot"--so I was informed--was recommended for a Stoker, and deservedly so. I'd like to recommend, for the journal category (is there such a category?), Supernatural Tales, which is one of the few horror journals I regularly enjoy--ST rarely publishes the middling horror I see so much of. For science fiction, Jan Wildt is one of the best authors working in the genre now, sadly underappreciated. He has some stories upcoming in Flytrap, I believe, and published a wonderful essay this year called "Assimilate This."

The suggestion made by some that good work isn't being published is extraordinary. You're either not reading very much or you aren't looking past the usual suspects. The latter is a rut I've seen people get into, and the only way out is for someone to make recommendations...

[ellen-datlow.livejournal.com]

I agree that Walther's story is terrific..I'm the one who recommended it for the Stoker and it's on my short list for YBFH #21. There is not journal/magazine category in the Stokers--anthologies and collections though.
And I second the recommendation of Supernatural Tales as a good bet for horror. That and All Hallows are very good places for a regular hit of supernatural fiction.

[bluetyson.livejournal.com]

What stories exist is partly a mystery, too, to most people?

I can go and look at LibraryThing or an online bookshop and find a novel, or book even - if it is an anthology/collection, the chance that the stories in it are listed is often slim.

Dozois' essay says the list he works on is in a notebook, handwritten!

Having a central story list of some sort would be of interest, certainly. Whether it is possible to do, not sure. Locus website and isfdb etc. will get a lot of them eventually, but that is zero use to those interested in the new and current now. That is bibliography and archival work, not sales and marketing.

Whether a 'current sfstories.com' website/wiki would ever happen with editors submitting their stuff, I dunno, or if they even want people to be looking at other work from other publications?

For instance, if someone would like to read a lot of the Horror stories from one year, how do they do it? No list exists outside the offices of some professional places? Same for Fantasy/SF. If you were a fantasy fan you might know some stories in Asimov's are fantasy - but which ones? Good luck finding out.

If Weird Tales or DarkHorrorWebzine3 had a couple of SF stories in a month, I would never know unless they got picked out into a collection.

Given all the competing interests, I am sure it is probably not likely to happen, but just having that list of stories would be helpful for readers, I think.

There are websites that do some sort of compilation of places writers can submit stories to, but that is not at all the same thing, locus has a list of places too, and both may or may not be up to date.

No money in doing the work to provide this info for people, perhaps, either. :(

However, the editors that get to hear about it all and are making spreadsheets are the most central people for the info that I can see.

However, none of that is focused or filtered enough to help people find what they are looking for.

JBU has some of the right idea - fantasy stories/science fiction stories at least labelled. New stories or serials? They forget about it there. Your big Year's Best splits it up - Strahan's didn't, that sort of thing, too.

[ellen-datlow.livejournal.com]

By checking the magazines I mention in my summary of the year, the reader can get a feel for what's in which magazine (I mention those magazines that are mixed-genre every year and mention darker stories I found in each one).

I'm not a big fan of labelling as a lot of the stories I read can be classified as both dark fantasy/horror. For example, one person's sf is another's horror story.

[kara-gnome.livejournal.com]

>>I have a really difficult time believing the first reason. I've been reading sf/f/h short fiction for twenty five years and have found no drop off in quality in any of those fields.

I can't answer for the second but I hope it's not true because if so my profession will die and I love editing short fiction.//

(no, we don't know each other--I'm here through David de Beer's blog :) Hi!)

I adore short stories, too, adore them! I've never talked about them with others, for some reason, but I certainly will now, in case it does make a difference. I think I've never felt qualified to nominate and vote. That seems best left up to people who know what are the best stories and novels, and who have read them all, too.

I also have not seen any drop in quality; if anything, the opposite. It seems unbelievable to me that people don't like the work being published; stuff today is fantastic! I feel as if now is a golden age and others are somehow missing it :D.

Anyway, this is a wonderful post, and thank you for sharing :)

[ellen-datlow.livejournal.com]

Thanks Kara, I'm delighted to see everyone's interest in the subject.

[james-nicoll.livejournal.com]

Does the decline in voter turnout for awards track the decline in voter turnout in real world elections?

[doc-lemming.livejournal.com]

(Got here through James Nicoll's post.)

I have to admit that of the magazines, the only one that I actually read almost all the way through is Black Gate. This seems to indicate a shift away from what I want to read.

On the other hand, I've liked the various "year's best" anthologies that I've read, yours and others. They're certainly of a higher degree of quality than I see in the magazines. I don't have access to anything other than the aforementioned Black Gate (and that by subscription), F&SF, and Analog, though I know that there are other magazines out there, I might like them. Don't know. Can't spend the money to try them if I don't see them/know about them.

I realize distribution is a separate problem, but I thought I'd give one (non-member's) take on the issue.

[ellen-datlow.livejournal.com]

Thanks for coming by. I think a big problem is that the perception is that contemporary sf/f is defined by "the big three"--and that's wrong. The field consists of many magazines plus original anthologies) that are publishing all types of fantastic fiction. I like some of the stories in the "big three" but do I think the stories in those magazines are more deserving of awards than those in other venues? Often not. I think it's crucial for readers to see what else is going on outside the usual places they read.

[(Anonymous)]

I do think good stuff is being published. I don't think enough great stuff is being published. "Publishable" stuff is being published, which is mildly depressing. More importantly, though, is if people aren't voting for things that fact might be symptomatic of something else. While it's admirable to suggest people vote, the fact that they aren't would mean to me, possibly, that they're not that enthused--at least, not enough to vote.

JeffV

[ellen-datlow.livejournal.com]

I personally feel that they're perhaps just not reading widely enough.

[david-de-beer.livejournal.com]

too many of the threads here have just gotten ridiculous. You asked what to blog about that would be of interest - well, you are one of the people most immersed in a constant reading and examination of short fiction.
That would be of interest, not just the usual content and quality/lack of quality blah blah, but the whole spiel - past, present, future. Where are we now, where are we headed.
Zines doing innnovative stuff (not just story-wise, but in every other component - packaging, new features).
Talk about the entirety of the medium, from the practical and specific, to theoretical.
Don't know about others, but that would interest me.
Blade Runner ain't a bad topic, though.

[ellen-datlow.livejournal.com]

Hoo boy. I hesitate to bash things in public but I have no problem praising things I like very much...

What I'd like to do is combine what you're saying with some of my recommendations during the reading year. (also listing the material I have received and have/will cover in 2007)?
How about if I start with a few of the novels I've enjoyed this year so far then move on to the magazines that I particularly like and why...et al?